The Fan Voice: "Rebounding Misleading? I Don't Think So!"

By Live or Die Magic | September 16th, 2008


So I was perusing the main forum on the Orlando Magic Message Boards today and noticed that our old friend Tim Povtak had landed on his feet after being let go from the Orlando Sentinel (still don’t understand that one!). He is now covering the NBA for the Sportsxchange on CBSSports.com. He has a current article about how all the top centers in the NBA are lining up behind Dwight Howard. Rightly so!

The posting of this article by Povtak ( http://orlandomagiczone.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/8891029871/m/8681092135/p/1 ) led to an interesting exchange among some of the Magic Message Board members about the importance of rebounding. Essentially, one of our fellow members stated that he felt that the reason Howard’s #1 ranking (according to Povtak) was justified was because of his rebounding prowess. Another member discounted this by stating that his rebounding numbers are misleading and that most of his rebounds are defensive and that his offensive rebounds are lower than others on this list (I’m paraphrasing…feel free to visit the thread to read for yourself).

Obviously, I found this comment surprising and although it wasn’t the only surprising thing the member said, it is the one item I choose to address at this point.

First off, during the 2007-2008 season, Howard led the league in rebounding average and total rebounds. He also finished fifth in offensive rebounds per game average last season with 3.4. This tied him with Brendan Haywood, and placed him behind Zydrunas Ilgauskas (3.6), Samuel Dalembert (3.7), Al Jefferson (3.8), and Tyson Chandler (4.1), all of whom are on Povtak's list. Please note that the difference was less than one offensive rebound per game. To further clarify, Howard finished with 279 offensive rebounds to Chandler’s 322. A difference of 43 offensive rebounds.

To show proof of a trend, during the 2006-2007 season, when Howard narrowly lost the rebounding title to Kevin Garnett, Howard averaged 3.5 offensive rebounds (total of 285). This placed him fourth in the league behind Emeka Okafor, Ben Wallace, and again, Tyson Chandler. Okafor and Wallace fell off this past season.

It is worth noting that Howard has maintained his ORB production from the 2006-2007 season when he averaged 12.3 total rebounds per game and added an additional 2 defensive rebounds per game to finish this past season with 14.2 total rebounds per game. I’m not sure how you can discount the defensive rebound considering that if you look at every major rebounder in the league, you will see that the majority of his rebounds are defensive. It is the nature of the game. On any given missed shot, at least half of the players on the court are attempting to get the rebound. It is extremely important to gain possession of the ball! When a player shows the uncanny ability to grab these rebounds at an extremely high rate while competing with other players who are trying to do the exact same thing, how can that possibly be a negative thing or something to gloss over?

But the best case to make is to look at the type of player finishing higher than or close to Howard in the offensive rebound per game average category. Of those that finished ahead of him, only Al Jefferson would be considered, like Howard, to be the 1st option on offense for his team. Of those finishing near or below him, only Tim Duncan, Antawn Jamison, Carlos Boozer, and Yao Ming would be considered the offensive threat that Howard is, combined with a high total rebounding average. Jamison and Boozer are not centers, Duncan is nearing the end of his prime, and Yao Ming will always have injury questions.

The point I’m trying to make in the above paragraph is that some players have a role on their teams to focus on rebounding, with offense taking a back seat, or a more supportive role in their games. In the vast majority of cases, the player getting the offensive rebound is NOT the person who just took the shot. Logically, it is much easier for a player to prepare to get a rebound as he watches his teammate attempt a field goal than for the shooter himself to get it. This helps explain why some of the other big men mentioned might have a slightly higher average than Howard, they are used to watching other players take the offensive loads on their teams. Howard takes a large number of shots for the Magic, making it all the more impressive that he gets the offensive rebounds that he does. Howard is the cornerstone of the team and was the first option on offense last season, finishing as the team's leading scorer. Despite this, he still managed to lead the league in total rebounding.

Here’s something else to consider…remember all of those 3-pointers that the Magic took last year? In case you’ve forgotten, the Magic averaged 25.3 three pointers per game last season, finishing 2nd behind only Golden State in that category. We averaged 78.6 total field goal attempts which means that a third of our shots were coming from long-range. Hey, guess what is hard to get when you are in the paint and a three pointer is launched!? An offensive rebound! No one else on Povtak’s list is on a team who came anywhere close to those numbers (total threes attempted and percentage of total shots). Had we shot fewer threes, perhaps Howard would have had more offensive rebounds. But then again, maybe we wouldn’t have won 52 games either.

Finally, please consider one final thing…Dennis Rodman, who could arguably be considered one of the best pure rebounders ever, who basically did nothing but focus on rebounds and could have cared less about taking field goals, never averaged more than 6.4 offensive rebounds per game.


This message was not subject of approval by the NBA or the Orlando Magic. The views expressed in this blog do not necessarily reflect the views of the Orlando Magic or the NBA, but solely the writer.

Yeah, my head hurt after that one especially since it is in a post that starts off with "I bow to your ignorance. Actually I don't, your statement just shows that you indeed no nothing about basketball."

I mentioned it in another thread but defensive rebounding is huge. Before Dwight during the Tracy years I can remember the team working hard on D only to give up multiple offensive rebounds. The 2nd, 3rd shots are back breakers and they almost always seem to go in, to minimize that is insanity.

Just a thought on the 3pt attempts, I wonder if having a guy like Pietrus that rebounds well as a guard doesn't mean more for a team like us that launches a lot of 3's than it would for a team that doesn't.

Something else to think about, of the people on that list, how many of them are by themselves going to the glass? How many of them have someone else putting a body the other teams center or PF? Dwight is out there on an island. Z has/had Gooden, Wallace, Joe Smith, Dalembert has Evans, Jefferson has Gomes and Juwan, and Tyson has David West. Not all of those guys are great rebounders but they do put a body on someone. Our entire team is on the perimeter.

quote:

Originally posted by Marc Acres 3:16:
Something else to think about, of the people on that list, how many of them are by themselves going to the glass? How many of them have someone else putting a body the other teams center or PF? Dwight is out there on an island. Z has/had Gooden, Wallace, Joe Smith, Dalembert has Evans, Jefferson has Gomes and Juwan, and Tyson has David West. Not all of those guys are great rebounders but they do put a body on someone. Our entire team is on the perimeter.

This is a great addition to my argument....I wish I had thought of it.

One of SVG's favorite mantra's is the defensive possession does not end until you "GET THE REBOUND". No one in the league does that better than Dwight!

The point about the long offensive rebounds off of three's is an excellent one too. Not only does our team take a lot of three's but so do our opponents. Why? Because with Dwight patroling the lane they know their chances are better on the outside.

quote:

Originally posted by bhnole:
The point about the long offensive rebounds off of three's is an excellent one too. Not only does our team take a lot of three's but so do our opponents. Why? Because with Dwight patroling the lane they know their chances are better on the outside.

That's true! The more that our opponents attempt to play our style of game, the fewer Howard's ORB chances.

That is why I thought it was comical when people were complaining about Dwight's lack of rebounding in the Olympics.

All of those teams are perimeter oriented and long shots always lead to long rebounds.

It would seem like something so simple would not be lost on so called basketball experts but it was.

The specific point that ties into your scenario of Dwight also being a part of the offensive scheme is that, when the Magic have the ball, Dwight is usually in a post-up position with his back to his defender. Meaning that his defender is between him and the basket.

The fact that he is often in this position when a shot is hoisted by his teammates puts him at an incredible disadvantage in getting the offensive rebound. Yet he has such great rebounding instincts and desire, that he still figures out how to get the rebound a significant number of times.

The Chandlers and Dalemberts of the NBA are simply asked to get into good offensive rebounding position as part of their offensive scheme as the play develops. Which is one of the reasons that Paul/Chandler lead the league in alley-oops: because Chandler is already heading to the basket for an offensive rebound, instead of attempting to establish a post-up position with a defender on his back.

Does anyone realize how hard it is to get a rebound when you intentionally put the person between you and the basket whose job it is to block you from the glass? That's asking a lot; an awful lot !!

Oh, and great analysis, LOD.

quote:

Originally posted by Live or Die Magic:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Marc Acres 3:16:
Something else to think about, of the people on that list, how many of them are by themselves going to the glass? How many of them have someone else putting a body the other teams center or PF? Dwight is out there on an island. Z has/had Gooden, Wallace, Joe Smith, Dalembert has Evans, Jefferson has Gomes and Juwan, and Tyson has David West. Not all of those guys are great rebounders but they do put a body on someone. Our entire team is on the perimeter.QUOTE]

This is a great addition to my argument....I wish I had thought of it.

True, but this is a two way street... if our team is on the perimeter, a lot of times the opponent defense is there too, leaving more space in the middle for Dwight.


Anyway, nice job as always LOD, I was on holiday in september and I'm reading your articles now.